I mentioned this book in another discussion about Israel but thought I would post it here as well. Julia Fisher is a british writer who has led many tours in Israel, (see her website, google on The Olive Tree Reconciliation Fund and it will come up with the web address). The book is a series of interviews with Messianic believers in Israel, what God is doing in Israel and their vision for the future, their view of their role in the world, the role of the Gentile church and the relationship between jewish/gentile believers. With so many other dire things happening elsewhere in the world within and outside the church, this was a breath of fresh air to me, a real inspiration, and made the relationship between jew/gentile much clearer to me - and brought me clarity, hope and fresh vision. There are some radio broadcasts on the website interviewing jewish believers with inspiring testimonies. LOL. Enjoy.
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Posted 1 year ago #
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Caribee, can you share with us briefly who these new disciples of Israel are.
Are they Gentile Christians interested in Israel?
Are they Jewish converts to Christianity?
Are they Messianic Believers?
Are they converts to Judaism?
Are they British Israelites wanting to return to Israel?Just who are they, what do they believe and what is their dream or goal?
Posted 1 year ago # -
Free Willie asked.
Are they Jewish converts to Christianity?
Are they Messianic Believers?3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Scripturally speaking there is neither Jew nor Gentile but we are ALL one new man in Christ Jesus. Some, it seems, think there is a difference between a Jewish convert to Christianity and a Messianic believer but, as said, scripture tells us, we are ALL one in Christ Jesus. It is why i said in another thred on this forum that i didn't really like the term "Messianic" it could be a little confusing to some people, maybe. What i am saying is, that a born again Jew in no longer a Jew and a born again Gentile is no longer a Gentile and it appears some are confused on this. We who are born again believers are ALL under this scripture -
Matt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
And this verse in Matt is to His Church.
John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
Matt 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
The nation being the Church. Just clarifying, is all.
Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.So we have NO need of keeping any special day or "sets of days" as we are NOT under the law. And He is our Sabbath, our rest and we should be Sabbathing/resting in Him daily.
Ken1.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Yes Ken1, but I am asking what these "new disciples of Israel" have come out of, not who they are now.
If you know what someone has come out of, you have an idea of their expectations and direction.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Ok Free Willie and i am just making the point that there is no difference in a Jew who converts to Christianity and a Messianic Jew, they are both the same "one new man in Christ"
Ken1.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Free Willie said:
If you know what someone has come out of, you have an idea of their expectations and direction....
good point!
Of course, we might not see their Future direction in Christ.... :)
(totally off the wall comment, that.)Posted 1 year ago # -
The book mentioned is excellent.
The new disiples referred to in the title are Jewish believers from various backgrounds who are now living and serving God in Israel.And again Ken, put aside the dispensationalist error you have learned from man's teaching and turn to GOD'S revelation to gain an understanding of the truth.
While you willingly remain bound to man's false teachings you will never find the truth.But you did get one thing right Ken, a Jew coming to faith in their Messiah is no different whether he calls himself a Christian or he calls himself a Messianic Jew.
However some are more comfortable with the latter and they find it helps more in relating to unsaved Jews because of “Christianity” being seen as a pagan, Jew hating religion – a view that history has reinforced.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Onesimus said.
And again Ken, put aside the dispensationalist error you have learned from man's teaching and turn to GOD'S revelation to gain an understanding of the truth.
While you willingly remain bound to man's false teachings you will never find the truth.Ken1
Onesimus i would perfare to see you try to back up what you say with scripture.Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.Ah! before faith came we were kept under the time/dispensation of the law. Ah! but after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster BUT! we are in the time/dispensation of the Church (Faith) BIG BIG difference, in case you have NOT noticed YET! And please refrain from the acusations!
Onesimus said.
But you did get one thing right Ken, a Jew coming to faith in their Messiah is no different whether he calls himself a Christian or he calls himself a Messianic Jew.However some are more comfortable with the latter and they find it helps more in relating to unsaved Jews because of “Christianity” being seen as a pagan, Jew hating religion – a view that history has reinforced.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
I perfare to stick with scripture no matter about history or any thing else. As said before, in some believers today there is a hankering after things of the law, feast days etc. Scripture makes a clear distinction between Mosiac law and the Church, so it is very important so seperate the dispensations and NOT get them mixed up as i have seen some do on this forum.
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon THY people (Jews) and upon thy holy city (Jeruslem) to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Again scripture NOT my opinion!
Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, !!! UNTIL !!! the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
11:27 For this is my !!! FUTURE !!! covenant unto them, when I SHALL take away their sins.Again scripture, WHEN will He take away their sins??? He will deal with them in THEIR 70th week of Daniel (THEIR dispensation) and He will take away their sins at the end of the 70th week of Daniel.
Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
Zec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel AFTER THOSE DAYS, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
After which days??? After those days of !!! THEIR !!! 70th week!
This is SCRIPTURE my friend NOT a doctrine of man.
Ken1.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Ken1,
Please get hold of a critical greek lexicon, and not just strongs, and drop this error of dispensation. It means administration of a household. Not a period of time. Can you handle the truth when you see it?Posted 1 year ago # -
Gospel truth, please quote scripture and your explanation of it as it seems to be ONLY opinions that are being said here. And please show me where you think i may be wrongly interepeting scripture that i have quoted here. I am only interested in replys that can be backed with scripture, which i have YET to see, please address the scriptures that i have quoted, thank you.
Ken1.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Yes Ken. lets drop the dispensationalism for a while here, two or three Threads here now , and you have spoken on this numerous times in several other threads, given freedom of your opinion but lets not continue to have to push and prove your therory and give respect to others views here please. Seems most here on this forum do not follow the teaching of Dispensationalism, so lets not turn this into a fight here please.
Back to the original Thread here.
I mentioned this book in another discussion about Israel but thought I would post it here as well. Julia Fisher is a british writer who has led many tours in Israel, (see her website, google on The Olive Tree Reconciliation Fund and it will come up with the web address). The book is a series of interviews with Messianic believers in Israel, what God is doing in Israel and their vision for the future, their view of their role in the world, the role of the Gentile church and the relationship between jewish/gentile believers. With so many other dire things happening elsewhere in the world within and outside the church, this was a breath of fresh air to me, a real inspiration, and made the relationship between jew/gentile much clearer to me - and brought me clarity, hope and fresh vision. There are some radio broadcasts on the website interviewing jewish believers with inspiring testimonies. LOL. Enjoy
Lynn:
I am very excited what God is doing in Isreal, it would be good if we christian believers paid more attention what is going on with the messanic Jews in Isreal, I believe God is speaking through this very Loud may we have ears to hear.God Bless, Lynn
Posted 1 year ago # -
Thank you for the information on Julia Fisher's web site. I have been to Israel a couple of times now, about to go again shortly. Being there and being a part of what the Lord is doing there is such a great blessing. Truly we as Christians need to know what is happening in Israel. It is so important at this time. Ignoring that which the Lord is doing in Israel is to our loss.
Blessings to all in the name of Yahshua.Robert
Posted 1 year ago # -
Hello Free Willie and everyone.... yes, the book is about the perspective and experience of Messianic believers, immigrant jews and those born in Israel (sabras?). As I borrowed the book from a friend but have returned it, I didn't have it to hand to comment any further, but there is a synopsis about it on Julia Fisher's website and one review on Amazon (where it can be purchased). Shalom.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I just have to comment on Free Willies post...
"Are they Gentile Christians interested in Israel?
Are they Jewish converts to Christianity?
Are they Messianic Believers?
Are they converts to Judaism?
Are they British Israelites wanting to return to Israel?"One of the things that becomes a true stumbling block to Jews who are searching and even think Jesus (yashua) IS the promised Messiah is that we tell them they have to become Christians and leave their Jewishness behind. Is their Torah or the Old Testament invalid? Not so! They only have to give their whole hearts to Jesus, be baptised, and Spirit-filled. They will then follow Him...not man.
According to the Jews, the name Messanic Jew is perfect. It denotes a Jew who has found the true Messiah! We should rejoice and offer up endless praises for that!
Posted 1 year ago # -
forhisglory, good statement about the identity of a jew having to become a "christian". Many Jews see christians as pesecuters of jews, so for them to say they are going to be a christian is absurd. The label of what they are after calling upon the name of Yeshua or Jesus is irrelevent as long as by faith they believe that Yeshua is Messiah. very stimulating discussions that will provoke us to know what we believe and that there could be some issues within the Christian community to take a look at, particularly in replacement theology. I would encourage all believers to at least take an objective look at replacement theology and what it may have done to our brothers and sisters who are jews. Be blessed, Shalom out.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Julia Fisher has recorded interviews with some of the people featured in her book, as well as others involved with ministry in Israel. They can be found here:
http://www.olivetreefund.org/radio-programmes.php
Each interview lasts about 12 minutes.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Proverbs 27:5,
"Open rebuke is better than secret love."Galatian2:12,
"But when Peter was come to Antioch,
I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed."3 John 1:10,
"Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds,
which he doeth, PRATING against us with MALICIOUS WORDS:
and not content therewith, neither doth he himself
RECEIVE THE BRETHREN, and forbiddeth them that would,
and CASTS them out of the church.Jesus said,
"And the King shall answer and say unto them,
Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren (me, ken),
ye have done it unto ME."Peace be unto you :)
I truly don't know Ken personally, as I am new here. But I honestly think that Ken made an excellent point, that we should focus on things that unite, such as OUR PRESENT STATE IN CHRIST, BELOVED, BEHOLD WHAT MANNER OF LOVE THE FATHER HAS BESTOWED UPON US, THAT WE SHOULD BE CALLED THE SONS OF GOD.
instead of letting the devil trick us into things that divide, such as what we used to be...thieves, liars, pimps, murderers, drug dealers, SPIRITUAL WHORES, SPIRITUAL WHOREMONGERS, or pre present post messianic non messianic or ADRIATIC...LOL...SINNERS SINNERS SINNERS...NEEDING GOD'S GRACE
instead of aliens from The Grace of God, wherein the Wrath of God was justly over usAnd to be honest, I truly think that some other people made good points as well, that it is important to know a person's background, so that you can know how to guide them closer to Christ.
In a nutshell, we should speak God's Truth In Love,
and not have respect of persons, and demonize and censor and falsely accuse with evil prating false labelsIf the dominant click group on this forum is so spiritual and full of God's Love, and vastly superior, to simple sinners like me and ken, then PLEASE at least SHOW ME CHRIST, by your example...instead of PONTIFICATING your OPINIONS...without ANY PROOF FROM GOD'S WORD.
The Apostle John was the closet to Jesus of all the disciples, lying on the breast of Christ, as much as possible,
in order to learn for himself, so that The True Apostle John could tell LOST SOULS, about Jesus Jesus Jesus,
God's Divine Love,
not promote israeli nationalism, or any other worldly agenda, under the cloak of a false Christianity.Christ unites, what sin divides.
If you guys had ears to hear what God was giving Ken to share, instead of immediately closing your hearts to what he was trying to share for the EDIFICATION of the Body Of Christ.
Lynn, with all due respect, does this Scripture mean any thing to you?
Romans2:11,
"For there is no respect of persons with God."I am new here, and and I am trying very very very hard to remain Peaceful and objective...
But Since Truth Sought me, and bought me, with His Redeeming Blood...I must Speak The Truth in Love,
that God is truly putting on my heart.1 - There seems to be a foul hypocrisy, FULL OF RESPECT OF PERSONS going on in this forum.
Here is the pattern I have noticed.2 - A certain "inner circle" click group seems to try to run things and control the posts around here.
3 - They politely allow a few others posts...until those posts accidently step on the self-centered, NOT CHRIST CENTERED, pet peaves of certain individuals.
4 - If any one does not agree with the MODERNIST dispensationalism, then the various click group members
gang up on, and try to demonize the person who makes well meaning opposing viewpoints, accusing them of a wide variety of EVIL MALICIOUS PRATING false CHARGES...
from anti-semitism to dispensationalism.5 - Then Lynn, who is supposed to moderate, with "no respect of persons, comes running in fear and pandering every time onesimus sneezes, to drive away and censor all debate based on The Truth of The Gospel of Christ.
Like I said in an earlier post...please grow up.
God does NOT take lightly to you using His Word for your PRIVATE AGENDA. If your feelings for the political nation of Israel are that strong, then I suggest you start a SEPERATE BLOG on another server, and stop sucking carnal Christians, who are not yet rooted and grounded in The True Gospel of Christ,
as God warned The True Apostle Paul,
"That we henceforth be no more children,
TOSSED TO AND FRO, and CARRIED ABOUT
with every wind of doctrine, by the SLEIGHT OF MEN,
and CUNNING CRAFTINESS, whereby they lie in wait TO DECEIVE;God warned us all,
And WHATSOEVER ye do in word or deed,
do all in the name of the Lord Jesus,
giving thanks to God and the Father by him.For the record, it brings NO GLORY TO GOD, whenever you
1 - bear false witness against another person,
saved or unsaved
2 - demonize and censor every one who does not believe,
walk, talk, or act like you. Shalom
3 - have respect of personsIn another post, someone threatened to email Andrew.
Lord Willing, I truly wish someone would email Andrew,
as a matter of fact, I might do it myself,
so he can know all the false crap that is going on
in this so Christian Revival blog, where every thing
is discussed EXCEPT Christian revival.May God have Mercy on us all, according to His Truly Merciful Will. Amen.
Posted 1 year ago #