1. steve
   Member

   IHOP’s has become incredibly influential since the God Channel started giving them around the clock coverage 24:7 since Jan 2010.
   .
   The 7 Qus I have about this, feedback appreciated:
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   1) Mike Bickle has now linked closely with Toronto and his students now all appear to manifest the Kundalini spirit which IHOP is now spreading quietly around the world via the God Channel, (which also promoted Todd Bentley in 2008). Is anyone else concerned about this?
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   2) Did the drama of Todd Bentley in 2008 prime us, and lull us, into thinking that satan will always move in such blatant and obvious way? Is this why so few people are warning about IHOP today? Surely satans normal way of operating is as subtly as a snake, until he has his prey firmly secured, when he then opens up fully. [IHOP are due to tour the UK this October and will then spread their influence even further here].
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   3) So many intercessiomn and youth ministries in the western world are now linked to IHOP. How will we be able to petition the Lord for revival in any Nos if they start moving in the Kundalini spirit if this carries on?
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   4) I am getting reports of people becoming very deceived by other ministries that are now linking to IHOP which have recently become influenced by them in the UK and N.Z. Why are there no warnings going out about this?
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   5) Mike Bickle led the Kansas city Prophets and we all know how deceived they were and how many disasters followed from that. Why would God use the same man to lead today’s youth and intercession ministries when there are no signs at all that he has even recognised how deceived he had been back then? Surely this can’t be from our God?
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   6)Bickle leaves it to his students to run the meetings but we have heard how controlling he really is and this seems to me to be reflected in the often forced, subdued and even depressed look on his team’s faces. This is certainly no revival. Surely satan is up to something big here?
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   7) If the end times are coming and one of the most influential groups promoting the Kundalini spirit is now IHOP surely we should be warning about this with vigor?

   S.Dobbs, Oct 2010, propheciesfortoday.uk.com wordconnect.org

   Posted 2 years ago #

2. MikeG
   Member

   Can you specify ways in which IHOP is deceiving the members? Im talking recently. Im aware of Bob Jones and Paul Cain. I consider that to be in the past. In their awakening meetings this year I cant recall ANY of the Toronto teachers or for that matter any from Rick Joyner being there. Matter of fact Bickle himself was rarely in attendance.

   Posted 2 years ago #

3. steve
   Member

   Hi MikeG: Well look at the every testimonies given on stage at IHOPs meetings and the accompanying manifestations and compare this with Andrew Stroms warning videos on the Kundalini spirit. They are identical. These youths have clearly been led by Bickle into a false anointing, a demonic spirit. Try also this article on IHOPs background etc http://www.wordconnect.org/page_article8.php
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   Look at Bickles own recent teachings online to see how confued he really is. Admittedly he also has some end times beliefs that I agree with mixed in with these heresies, but in a way this makes him all the more dangerous. Stanley Frodishams famous prophecy specifically warns about those with such a mixtur who are followed because they also teach some truth mixed in.
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   Bickle literally teaches for e.g. that Jesus will return to earth and lead a physical carnal war against his enemies, that his cloths are described as crimson red due to all the blood he will shed as he physically kills his enemies and gradually comes to power on earth. Bickle says that those who follow the beasts armies will be gradually rounded up and put into concentration campsawaiting a Nuremburg style judgement, (Im not joking). And that Christians will get resurrection bodies a few at a time as Jesus gradually moves around the world conquering it in this blood thirsty and carnal way. It beggers belief but is listed on his own sites teachings.
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   When the false christ appears a form of this teaching is bound to pave the way for his carnal government of the world. So thinking about this now Bickles teaching is even paving the way for the antichrist.Thankds for proving me to more thought on this.

   Posted 2 years ago #

4. marilynk
   Member

   Steve, as I read your concerns my thought was that it takes only one prayer spoken in faith to move the heart of God. If a multitude of faith filled saints partnered together it would pull down the spiritual strong hold no quicker. It is the faith of the one interceeding that releases the power of God into the realm of man. I have reach the conclusion that some of these people are not aware of their own deception. At some point pride entered into their hearts and it gave the legal geound over to these things. I am certain that God did all that he could to influence them to turn their hearts back fully to him before he released them from the safety of his of his palm.

   I went to a meeting several years ago where John Arnott(?) was ministering. Had never heard of him. On the way God told me that he had been called as a apostle. They were having an impartation service. I'm sure you know where this is going. Well, I watched things that night that I had never seen. I was seated right behind John and when it came time to minister he turned around to me and took my hands in his. He told me not to be affraid, just receive it. (whatever it was) That night I deampt that Carol had her hands on the small of my back and stomach while she prayed in the spirit. I found myself jerking so hard in my sleep that my bed was over a foot from the wall. Did not know what had happened. I do know that God is removing the keys of authority and leadership from these people. That spirit was not able to enter into me.

   As I listen to some of these once great sevents of God now and compare them to what was given to them before it is easy to see when the transition from truth came.

   Posted 2 years ago #

5. steve
   Member

   I understand its hard to weigh a word actually on ones way to a meeting. Try Andrew Stroms own videos and articles on this. They will be on this site somewhere. Or I have copies I can direct you to below;

   Try here for Andrews article, (copy and paste it into bar?):

   http://www.wordconnect.org/page_background_article_kundalini.php

   and here for a short 3 min video;

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RVAu1uGkew&NR=1

   There is also 9 min version somewhere.

   I strongly recommend you em Andrew and contact him yourself over this.

   Be careful and God bless you Marilyn.

   Posted 2 years ago #

6. avoice
   Member

   i'm confused about "God told me that (John Arnott had been called to be an apostle)
   Is that a typo, or did you just think it was God?
   I'm a little confused by your post.

   Posted 2 years ago #

7. MikeG
   Member

   Hi Steve,

   You said:

   Hi MikeG: Well look at the every testimonies given on stage at IHOPs meetings and the accompanying manifestations and compare this with Andrew Stroms warning videos on the Kundalini spirit. They are identical. These youths have clearly been led by Bickle into a false anointing, a demonic spirit.

   Me:

   For a while I was watching their program practically every night. While I have never been comfortable with some of the odd shakiness and so on I have been impressed by the at least seeming fruit of deliverance people turning to Christ or getting a closer walk with him.

   I was out among the Pentecostal Churches for years back in the 70's and 80's and the shaking is nothing new. It has always been among Pentecostal people and always seemed to requie a case by case analysis whether it was of the Holy Spirit or not.

   Personally I have never known of a mainstream Charismatic Church that teaches holiness, intimacy with Jesus and the fear of God as IHOP does. The young people there impress me even more than the ones I came up with in the Jesus Movement with.

   As far as Jones I have not heard his name mentiond one time in all the meetings I have seen there. Neither ANY of the men mentioned in the link.

   I have seen people like Misty Edwards there teaching the forsake all discipleship message far better and more accurately than most any big name Preachers I ever saw.

   Steve said:

   Bickle literally teaches for e.g. that Jesus will return to earth and lead a physical carnal war against his enemies, that his cloths are described as crimson red due to all the blood he will shed as he physically kills his enemies and gradually comes to power on earth. Bickle says that those who follow the beasts armies will be gradually rounded up and put into concentration campsawaiting a Nuremburg style judgement, (Im not joking). And that Christians will get resurrection bodies a few at a time as Jesus gradually moves around the world conquering it in this blood thirsty and carnal way. It beggers belief but is listed on his own sites teachings.

   Me:

   Hmm not sure that this is a great deception of some kind. I do not believe only a few will be resurrected at a time. I would like to see a link proving he said that. As far as Jesus fighting a war against the governments of Earth I fully agree that he will.

   Posted 2 years ago #

8. marilynk
   Member

   A voice: It is the anointing God purposed for him to walk in. Just as it was the anointing that had been purposed for Judas. In both cases deception entered in at some point and things went very wrong in there lives. Never followed John Arrnott or Mike Bickel. I have listened to some of Mikes teachings. They began very sound and then felt some what off center. Many that walk as false prophets now were actually called to walk in that anointing. What brings about the seperation from truth in their lives would be the place that pride entered in to their ministries. Self cannot enter in when you walk in the prophetic or apostolic. It simply is not about them, it is about God.

   Steve: I watched those videos and read his book. Believe me it birthed concern in me. Had never heard of any of these things before. Spent time in prayer and repenting of anything that the Holy Spirit brought to mind that would give over a legal ground for that spirit to have a hold on my life. I remember as I watched the events of that meeting: Why aren't they casting the demons out of these people. When I asked questions they said things about being humiliated for Christ's sake. When my pastor at that time decided that we as a body should watch Todd Bentley in the Florida outpouring. My thoughts went to the same place. Why don't they cast the demons out of him?

   The Holy Spirit reveils to me the anointings on his servents lives. I suppose it could fall under a form a discernment. It is enteresting to me when I meet people.

   That God could reveal to me his annointing on the way to a meeting would not suprise you If you knew the amount of time I spent in fasting, prayer and the Word of God at that time of my life. I saw things of spirit that would never had occured to me was possible. Perhaps it was a part of the training to stand in the calling on my life. You have to see what has gone so horribly wrong in the body of Christ to stand in the gap for them.

   Posted 2 years ago #

9. Peter Lawrence
   Member

   Steve, that link from S. Dobbs was a timely word.

   I haven't seen Ihops as I don't watch God TV, but I agree very much with all concerns about this wave of deception.

   I put a post up on the Penticostal Pope and would like your thoughts there please.

   I agree with what Marilyn is sharing about they often start off with Gods anointing and callings, but so many lose there way and indeed, pride lets that deception in.

   There has been lots of critism of the WOF movement here and I agree the whole movement lost its way. If we remember Solomon had two visitations from God but lost his way in his old age.

   It wasn't maybe pride there, just disobedience marrying foreign women. But also years ago I got a great deal from Kenneth Hagin's books but clearly he lost his way also.

   But I believe he did not start out that way. On another thread someone said he repented before he died of getting sucked into all the false prosperity and other doctrine.

   That is why I think God is doing such a thorough job in breaking and preparing the last day disciples for the final days. There is so many people who had more faith, saw more miracles and had a greater anointing than you and me who are no longer in ministry but backslidden and given up. The seed that falls amongst the thorns. Or they have fallen into pride and deception.

   Has anybody ever heard of Church of the Way. Apparently the leader Jim Swilley started out ok, but now the guy even writes his own bible...John in the now, Matthew in the now. etc. They follow universalism and they have been trying to spread there heresies to churches in parts of Asia now.

   We have a whole generation of especially young people who are following Avatar and other new age doctrines. I see it all getting swallowed up into a one world universal religion for all faiths and all sexual persuasions.

   Keep the warnings coming. Thanks.

   Posted 2 years ago #

10. steve
    Member

    To MikeG: Ive tried but the site has changed (it was a couple of yrs ago that I saw that). It was something like:

    ARMAGEDDON AND THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST

    Its takes a dedicated eye to deal with though as 8its so long and complicated you cant rush through it if you do find his teachings. If i were you and you intend to follow Bickle as appears to be the case I would spend 2 months checking out as many of his teachings for your self first and PRAY.
    .
    The Toronto manifestations are evident but I predict will increase massively once the foothold has been gained with people.
    .
    These are days of great deception so dont just open to any spirit in any ministry, there is usually a reason why other charismatic Christians are concerned about such ministries. Many however dont look deepper than the nice light show and guitars .. so what can one do?? its up to them to test all things for themselves, if they dont then...

    Posted 2 years ago #

11. MikeG
    Member

    Steve,

    I do not intend to be a follower of Bickle. I just want to see the bad things that are coming out of IHOP people keep talking about. As I said during the past Winter and Summer I watched a lot of stuff from there.

    I noticed that COMPARED TO the other Charismatic Churches they DO teach a lot of truth. I dont agree with much of their FOUNDATION doctrine but I agree more with them generally than with the Protestant Churches.

    In the THREE ANGELS THREAD it is being said its the message thats important. Then we look at the message on that thread being holiness, intimacy with Christ, and the fear of God thiIS what I saw consistently being brought forth in the Prayer Room and the Awakening broadcasts.

    They teach these things along with the post trib rapture. It appears they do a lot of witnessing and teaching about discipleship.

    I am FAR more concerned about young people being led into a Baptist, Lutheran, Reformed, ect type Church than IHOP. I consider (from what I have seen)they are the closest to the truth of what I believe than any other Protestant or Charismatic Church that I have ever seen.

    Having said that compared to what the Bible presents on foundation doctrine they have a lot of truth to still come to. So my statements are comparing IHOP to other mainstream Churches when they are favorable to them.

    Now if you would be so kind can you point out specifics where bad fruit is coming forth there I would appreciate it. Since you think I want to follow Bickle and you assume him to be a dangerous cult figure show me the facts.

    Posted 2 years ago #

12. MikeG
    Member

    Steve says

    These are days of great deception so dont just open to any spirit in any ministry, there is usually a reason why other charismatic Christians are concerned about such ministries. Many however dont look deepper than the nice light show and guitars .. so what can one do?? its up to them to test all things for themselves, if they dont then...

    Me:

    Well thats what I have done. I have been observing the Charismatic Movement since 1974. I would consider myself a Charismatic/Pentecostal Christian.

    I see far worse error in the other Charismatic Churches of the day than at IHOP. Again Im only speaking concerning those things I have personally seen or heard from them.

    And though the worship there is generally much greater than most groups I have been around that is not what drew my interest to them.

    The first time I saw Misty Edwards I knew she was different. The music was great but the message more balanced than ANY musician I have ever known of.

    It was the fear of God, judgment, deep intimacy, post tribulation rapture being presented in song. After some study about her it began to be clear she was with IHOP and Bickle was their leader.

    I had read The Kansas City Prophets book when it came out and decided not to get involved with them. I lost track of Bickle for years.

    Then after hearing Mistys music and seeing other Youtubes from IHOP we started watching them in the Prayer Room.

    I fully expected Mike Bickle to be there leading everything. Paul Cain and Bob jones to be highly revered. Yet in months of watching I think Bickle was in the Prayer Room TWICE. Not even once have I heard Paul Cain or Bob Jones mentioned. I was pleasantly surprised.

    During the whole of their "awakening meetings" that were widely publicized not ONCE did these men or ANY of the Charismatic false prophets appear. No Joyner, no Arnott, no Wagner. None.

    To me I took that as a sign they were moving away from them. I hope I am right.

    I emphasise again that I feel IHOP has a long way to come to catch up to true Apostolic Foundational teaching. But I consider then farther along than most.

    If THEY are dangerous and to be feared what about the rest of the Churches that are so far from the holiness, intimacy with Christ and fear of God? Why are there not threads about the dangers of the Baptist Church? The Lutheran Church? Methodist? The Protestant Movement?

    In my opinion IHOP represents Christianity better than they do. I hope they will continue to grow in the things of God and not stop where they are. I dont think they are a fully developed New Testament Church.

    In these dark times however they stand out in those three areas deemed very important on this forum.

    HOLINESS, INTIMACY, THE FEAR OF GOD.

    Posted 2 years ago #

13. JimC
    Member

    Michelle,

    You're wise to stay far away from those people and anybody like them.

    You are a New Creation and you are complete in Christ!

    Jim

    Posted 2 years ago #

14. MikeG
    Member

    IHOP is not the Toronto Church. Yes I agree with Jim that sounds like a very unscriptural practice.

    Posted 2 years ago #

15. steve
    Member

    To Michelle; thank you so much for giving us that testimony and lets hope any on here who want to open up to the same influence will have been warned against this now. You are not the only one. This spirit will sometimes excite people, even for years until a person realises their error and wants to break free from it. Others can be affected badly straight away like you were.I dont think it was anything to do with praying against generational curses though but the spirit they had received and then prayed into you. In a way you were fortunate it did you a little harm straight away as many go on recieving a demonic anointing for years before it turns and it then has a great hold on them.

    Heres the link to Andrew Stroms article and other testimonies again which show just how dangerous this can be.

    http://www.wordconnect.org/page_background_article_kundalini.php

    To MikeG: Please try the above link.
    Mike Bickle is in strong alliance with the Toronto movement and John and Carol Arnott and the manifestations are from the same spirit. Its not just a bit of shaking but often weird odd contortions and jerking movement seen normally in the New Age and Kundalini cults. Note no such thing was ever reported in the bible. Jesus didn’t behave like this and the Spirit came more on him than anyone. But it is spreading everywhere these days so much so that younger Christians believe this is normal. And it will get worse. I will add another entry as I’ve found part of the teaching I mentioned earlier by Mike Bickle. [This is my first attempt at this and I’m not sure I’m cut out for it to be honest].

    Posted 2 years ago #

16. steve
    Member

    No I have one of the articles saved in word but the one online is slightly different and since we are talking about 15 pages I just dont have the time. This wasnt what i was expecting to do here. This is the best I can do for now heres the Title of this article maybe you can find it and the others online and take up your own study before you go anywhere near this group?
    .
    FORERUNNER SCHOOL OF MINISTRY
    ARMAGEDDON AND THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST
    IHOP-KC Mission Base
    http://www.IHOP.org
    Armageddon Campaign: The Battle of the Great Day of God Almighty
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    Here are some direct quotes from its 15 pages in which Mike Bickle shares his teaching of what he thinks happens at Jesus 2nd coming;
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    "The final event of natural history is the appearance of Jesus as that Warrior-King...The Battle for Jerusalem will not be over in fifteen minutes....He will strike the evil nations in a progressive battle, causing the blood to flow far and wide...Jesus splits the sky with His appearing and liberates the captives, it won’t be instantaneous, but a process! It will take time...Jesus will trample or crush the unrighteous like grapes in a large winepress. The wine of human blood will fill the land and stain His garments. Jesus will stomp these nations in righteous rage....Why is Jesus fighting on a horse?...Horses will be the only way that people will get from 1 place to the other. After 911 for several blocks, cars could not drive through because of the rubble. Armageddon is happening after Rev. 16. The horses are not figurative. The landscape will require actual horses. God’s judgments will destroy infrastructures that cause the oil supply to get to the people. There will not be fuel for vehicles...Jesus’ procession on the land: traveling from Egypt through Jordan.... In Psalm 45... This Psalm portrays the glory and the terror of Jesus returning to Jerusalem to fight to end the Armageddon Campaign... Jesus will wear a robe that will be dipped in blood... The stains of their blood will be seen on His garments... . Jesus goes through the land killing Gentile kings who sought to destroy Jerusalem...He will personally slay them and their blood will fill the valley."
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    Mike Bickle clearly has a very earthbound view of what happens just after Christs second coming in which Jesus literally goes around the world slaughtering people over a period of time. I cant find the other articles yet which say he fights like King David and puts his enemies in concentration camps before holding Nuremburge style courts of judgement on earth but I am certain of that too. Perhaps you can find those quotes. I feel Ive done my bit here on this.

    Posted 2 years ago #

17. steve
    Member

    To Michelle again: IHOP stands for the "International House Of Prayer" based in Kansas City, led by Mike Bickle who was also the pastor of the notorious Kansas City prophets, most of the main ones were found to be very sexually immoral, Eg Paul Cain and Bob Jones but others too, (bad fruit),and experienced occult visions etc. Not deliberately though, they were deceived, and it cant be easy getting sanctified when they were moving in the wrong spirit.

    I hope you are OK these days. If you are not and are based in the UK I can recommend a good place to go for prayer - but you sounded as though you are over it??? It is testimonies like yours that carry more weight than anything so thanks again.

    For everyone; heres that short 3 min video made by Andrew Strom which warns about the dangers of false spirits invading the churches these days.

    Posted 2 years ago #

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